Parental Alienation and the Domestic Abuse Bill UK

The internet is awash today with the misinformation that the new UK Domestic Abuse Bill includes parental alienation as a form of domestic violence.

From an early morning posting which shows the MP Philip Davies’s tabled amendments for inclusion of parental alienation as a form of domestic violence, this story has run around the world on facebook groups and other places as being a done deal. It is not.

It is not a fact.  It is false news and the creation of false news of this nature, where vulnerable parents are concerned, is worrying.

To be clear.  The Domestic Abuse Bill is at Report Stage. You can read the Report here.

You can see the process which will now be undertaken in Parliament to consider the Bill as it stands, the Report from the Committee and the Amendments which have been tabled here.

From the Parliamentary Website

 

Screenshot 2020-07-02 at 14.42.10

From the above infographic you can see how a Bill passes through Parliament. This Bill is at report stage, this means that there will a third reading in the House of Commons before it is passed to the House of Lords.

During this time, much lobbying of MP’s will occur and organisations representing parents will make submissions in response to the Report.  There will be a process by which the Bill will potentially go back and forth for debate until the House of Commons and the House of Lords are agreed on its wording.

This is not not a time for rejected parents to be misled into believing that parental alienation will now be automatically included in the act when it receives Royal Assent.

Crystal clear understanding is required in this field.

Keep your critical thinking skills sharp.

Educate yourself.

Don’t believe everything you read on the internet.

 

 

 

44 comments

  1. Thank you Karen. One does hope for those parents and children and grandparents who are victims of Alienation in England and Wales your Parliament will do the right thing and include PA within the DV Bill. Sadly here in Guernsey we are very very much at the Neanderthalic knuckle dragging stage where the target parent is the father and ultra feminists within our government are detestable of the Male gender even transgender males are targeted. The realism is here in Guernsey any change to our laws will not be carried out for at least 50 years…Sadly, if it were same sex couples the law would be changed over night..The harsh reality of a backward corrupt island..

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  2. Unfortunately what the Feminist lobby groups are trying to promote, is a GENDERED BILL that PROMOTES INEQUALITY. Disgracefully what Karen Woodall implies is that FALSE ALLEGATIONS are so low that IT IS NOT WORTHY of being reprimanded when Deceitful Resident Parents attempt to prevent Children from seeing their non resident parent AND THAT PARENTAL ALIENATION is not based in FACT. That in itself is a nefarious DECEPTION and like a Slippery POLITICIAN with a HIDDEN AGENDA. She ATTEMPTS to DISCREDIT thid OBVIOUS FACT with PROPAGANDA and MANIPULATED STATISTICS. In an attempt to prevent LIARS Narcissists and Vindictive Parents from being CROSS Examined in Family COURT and REPRIMANDED for PERJURY Thus allowing CHILDREN TO BE USED AS A WEAPON in ACCESS AND RESIDENCY CASES.

    To illustrate some HIGH PROFILE INSTANCES to PROVE THIS. I have included a sample of a catalogue of Articles Studies and ANECDOTAL EVIDENCE BELOW:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-10694975

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10778971/Father-wins-damages-after-social-worker-falsely-accused-him-of-abusing-daughter.html

    https://www.familypsychologyreports.uk/

    Join me in the STRUGGLE in preventing ABUSE in ALL ITS FORMS. For all people FAMILY JUSTICE EQUALITY.

    https://www.change.org/p/uk-government-most-capable-parent-to-gain-full-custody-of-children-in-relationship-breakdown-preventing-parental-alienation

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    1. Hi Shaun, absolutely superb post. You certainly do express the blindness of many in the system who advocate PA due to gender discrimination and financial gain. Please drop me an email in order one can support you and your cause. More then happy to oblige.

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    2. Mmmmmmmm…..

      what I am saying is that the facts in the posts around the internet about PA being included in the DA Bill are wrong.

      And vulnerable parents should not be misled into believing untrue things.

      But let’s not let that get in the way of a bit of shouting and some more misinformation shall we.

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    3. As a parent of an 8 year old whose father is trying to rid me and my family off the face of the earth, I humbly state it is a real issue that brings a tremendous amount of pain.

      My child was forced to sit on camera with her father, denouncing me for the sole purpose of putting me down. Making a child sit and be filmed for a Facebook post is detrimental to a child’s wellbeing. You cannot tell me she will not in her later years, feel shame, embarrassment and guilt for humiliating simply because her father wants to make a point. PAS is real and regardless of what he thinks of me because I am fighting for my child, using a child in that ,anger is despicable.

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      1. Anna, my gosh you certainly have been demonised by your ex because you are a parent. I am ashamed of my gender when there are so called fathers who go out to destroy and alienate a mother and child/dren from each other based upon vindictive behaviour. It is those perps who do not deserve contact but prison time and therapy. I empathise with you and wish you the very best going forward..I am an alienated father. My children are also alienated victims. Your ex my ex and thousands of other exs who wield such evil control can only do this because the system allows this..CAFCASS and FPAS are rotten from the top down but they too are protected by those who hold greater power who have vested interests to allow PA to continue unabated.

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      2. Thank you for understanding. He had the audacity to put my young lady on Facebook denouncing me and saying she wants to live there. She looked so uncomfortable, sadness in her eyes! Clear psychological abuse. It’s a classic form of Spitting. I’m almost ready to give up the fight of custody just so I can focus on rebuilding my relationship with my daughter so that when she gets older and wiser, she will leave him, come back home to me and we can be happy again.

        I’m sorry you had to endure this abuse but just do as much as you can so the children will know you are there.

        Thank God for forums like this to vent, and professionals like Dr. Baker and Dr. Childress whose wisdom has kept me from jumping off a bridge. Take care and hang in there.

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  3. Bless you Karen. I know exactly what you are saying and so do many other parents who have been targeted and alienated. Thank you for reporting on this. There are so many misconceptions around ………….

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    1. Being alienated and on the internet brings enormous risk, not least misinformation Willow. The biggest risk is that mixing with genuinely alienated parents are some very dangerous people claiming to be alienated. Just like those who make false claims of DV do real victims a massive disservice, so do those who falsely claim PA. I know how dangerous these people are, I have to differentiate between them and genuine victims of PA and doing so causes me no end of trouble when the false claimant of PA who is exposed then attacks, stalks and harasses me. I am stalked, harassed and lied about all over the internet by anti alienation AND pro alienation people – so a bit of ranting on here isn’t going to faze me but sometimes I think you really could not make this stuff up!

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      1. I used capitals too emphasize points (no bold option on here). Yes I said false allegations as a universal blanket. Not favouring a GENDER. Without balance and fairness it promotes resentment and hate.

        What your allies are doing is trying to prevent (I have watched the Parliamentary debates over the Domestic Abuse Bill and I have seen the so called forums that your supporters populate.

        It reminds me of Josef Stalin when he gained power in Russia power hoarding then removing people when he had no use for them. Using disarming neutral language when dealing with decision makers that can help acheive your goal of greater protection for women and mothers. FAIR ENOUGH THAT IS HOW IT SHOULD BE. BUT NOT AT THE EXPENSE OF GOOD MEN WHO ARE TRYING TO STAY IN THEIR CHILDREN’S LIVES However when it comes to MALE VICTIMS of Domestic Abuse and false allegations. You and your partners ARE dismissive evasive or attempt to TRIVIALIZE the various grotesqueries of toxic and emotionally warped feminists. SILENCING MANKIND INITIATIVE and then ACCUSING PHILIP DAVIES of MISOGYNY, when he made LOGICAL REASONABLE AMENDMENTS to protect MEN from falling PREY to vindictive coercive MISANDRIST MOTHERS/WOMEN Who SHAM at Equality. Yet by your own WORDS in this BLOG You have stated that you and your ALLIES will be opposing THESE AMENDMENTS VIGIOUROUSLY. To me that is nefarious odious and hypocritical. Are you really SEEKING JUSTICE? Or is your Agenda to put FEMALE CONCERNS AND HELP at the EXPENSE OF FATHERS/MEN?

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      2. Shaun, your post would be funny if it were not tragic. For goodness sake read what I write and stop jumping to conclusions.

        You think my allies are feminists? Read what I wrote and think about it – or for goodness sake someone come on here and help Shaun out and stop him shouting at me! 🙂

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    2. Any alienated parent or grandparent relishes any news or fake news regarding legitimate legislation which encompasses PA within its policies. We also are only to aware of the utter desperation and alienation we experience minute by minute by minute by our exs and the corrupt practices of CAFCASS/FPAS and the family courts. what we are also subjected to by our tormentors is discrimination on a huge scale..some of you may not like it agree with Shaun’s post but some alienated parents may fully agree with his post. What Shaun’s post seems to have unintentionally opened up is a ‘side taking mentality’. A behaviour we all know only to well..I’m sure Karen in her professional career is used to constructive criticism. We are not on this forum to take sides but to come together without prejudice or fear. Our voices and that of our children have been silenced by the rotten system of discrimination..let’s not use the same destructive behaviour we are victims of on this forum.

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      1. I don’t see criticism in Shaun’s post I see someone focused only on his own point of view to the degree where anyone who doesn’t mirror that back to him is seen as the enemy.

        I posted an information piece which was focused on ensuring that a) alienated parents understand the reality of what is happening in the DA Bill and b) helping parents to understand the Parliamentary process so that they won’t get fooled again by misinformation about the DA Bill.

        That is because I care about alienated parents and I am concerned about the way in which such vulnerable people are being mislead by campaigners who don’t really understand this space.

        Whether people agree with me or not is not really the point – the point is that Shaun opened up the side taking mentality by assuming that I was saying something that I wasn’t saying.

        That’s a trap many alienated parents fall into – it’s called splitting – and alienated parents use it as a defence as well as children. Which isn’t helpful to anyone because it stops information from being shared and absorbed properly.

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  4. It will come as no surprise that this is a toxic space.

    One full of abusive individuals who will stop at nothing in their quest to undermine hard work undertaken freely on others behalf. Or to uphold falsehoods which serve vested interests and / or ideologies.

    Both of which sacrifice children’s mental health and well-being and move you further away from your goal of spending time with and loving your own children. It fills us with rage.

    We firstly wanted to say how sorry we are for issuing a post earlier today, that we were sent in the early hours, which looked like the courageous efforts of Philip Davies MP had been initially successful.

    That our Home Secretary and Lord Chancellor had taken on board his amendments and listened to your collective pleas to include the psychologically abusive behaviour of parental alienation in the new Domestic Abuse Bill.

    It is impossible to comprehend the profoundly disturbed mind of any individual & colleagues who would doctor an official Government paper and commit fraud, in order to try and ‘catch’ others out.

    We are clear who did this and have reported it as a cyber crime. Hopefully we will be able to update you on this soon.

    Any organisation who would deliberately raise your hopes of a resolution only to dash them again, is beyond redemption.

    Charlatans and false prophets will be exposed..

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    1. Peter, is this from a group or from you personally? It would be useful to name the group if it is an apology so that people can understand how such things happen.

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      1. Ah, I see where this post from Peter has come from – facebook groups run by inexperienced people are not helpful to vulnerable parents in my view.

        First rule for alienated parents – don’t use facebook groups as your primary source of information unless you can trust that the people running them are experienced.

        Campaigns are great, I have nothing against them but they fail miserably when they misinform followers and promise things that cannot be delivered to vulnerable people.

        Think Once, Think Twice, Think Critically.

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      2. Karen, I fully endorse and agree with your post. We have a charity here in Guernsey who is primarily a DV charity with the best intentions and I respect the people running the charity. However, the literature is misleading and neither member is trained in PA..They are all over sm and were recommended to me. I declined and advised others to do the same. I must reinforce I was not behaving in a vexatious manner but purely to protect the alienated parent from misinformation.

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    2. Peter Karen , I think we all should be focusing on the person or group who doctored a government document to mislead grieving parents . Who ever posted this misleading plagiarised post have no interest in helping children who are the main victims here. The finger pointing should be directed at the person or group .who posted it . Not at other groups who are genuinely trying to raise awareness. Anne O Regan

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      1. Anne, this is about giving vulnerable people the factsand that is all it is.

        If you want to believe in misinformation, however it was arrived at – then by all means point the finger at whoever you want.

        Whoever re-posted it doesn’t understand parliamentary process and it is vital in circumstances where vulnerable parents are depending upon you for information, to make sure you do.

        As for conspiracy theories, I try to stay well away from them.

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    3. Davies I take it?
      On first reading this post I instantly thought of you guys.
      I have read other fake stuff when I was on your pages.
      Whoever has done this should be jailed in my eyes, I know 💯 this would had cost life’s, it’s well documented that life’s have been lost before via false information.
      Why people would wish death on people by making false reports is beyond me & is very disturbing.

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      1. Chris, I am letting you have this post but the rest I am not publishing – not because I am silencing you but because to be honest, this issue is yesterday’s news and you appear to be coming on here with an agenda. To respond to your points – 1. Davies – No it is not. 2. Fake stuff on these pages I am afraid I disagree. 3. Whatever the issue is being huffed and puffed about over this report, false or otherwise has nothing to do with me or anyone else. I think it was a mis reporting and that’s it.

        As for wishing death by making false reports, I don’t really understand what you mean.

        Shaun apologised, I accepted that apology, if you don’t like that then I am afraid there isn’t much I can do about it.

        To reiterate – this is NOT a forum – I do not run it so that parents can come on and argue with each other or with me. This is a blog, I write it in my spare time. Sometimes people comment on it, sometimes we debate, sometimes we disagree.

        I am not a guru, I am not someone to follow, I am not someone who wants parents to do anything other than survive this nightmare. I write because that is what I do and I write about what I do.

        Nothing more to be said.

        Karen

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    1. Karen I understand that whoever shared this misleading post got it wrong. My concern is the person/ group who posted it with intention to mislead, they have not been targeted by people the who should be hounding them out. Why is it you and your supporters are not trying to find them ? we need to protect people parents grandparents and most of all children so I cant quite understand why you are not trying to-do this,yes you are targeting the people who shared it but the culprit stays safe.

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      1. I think you are getting yourself lost in conspiracy theories myself and you could do to understand what is going on a little more in depth.

        First off – who are ‘my supporters’ what is this nonsense about supporters? This is the language of the playground (or facebook groups) where people think that the more likes they get the more powerful they are – it is nonsense, utter nonsense, the world of children might work like that but we are adults – aren’t we? I have no real idea what you mean by hounding out a person or people who have posted this or tried to mislead people – the bit that was posted was from the report and it is still in there – it is an amendment not a done deal – which was the way it was posted a few days back, which mislead people. But before you go off with your mob hunting down a person or group of people who are supposed to have done this on purpose, think carefully – a) was it really a deliberate act to mislead someone who is running a face book group or b) was it a simple mistake on the part of someone who doesn’t understand parliamentary processes? Either way, it is not difficult to see how people get tangled up in a mess of rumination and cross projection of blame in this field. Am I blaming anyone? No. Do I really care why it was misposted? No. The only thing I care about is that vulnerable parents get information they can rely upon. The rest I’m afraid, is all in your imagination.

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  5. WOW…Peter & Karen, thank you for your very informative post. Let’s hope the perps get caught and openly exposed..

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  6. Quoting Shaun’s argument :

    “VICTIMS of Domestic Abuse and false allegations”. Just this tiny bit of one sentence says everything to me about where he is coming from and what he is so angry about and so we all continue to go round and round in circles with the same old problem – which is (what I understand as) Parental Alienation V what some see as Domestic Abuse by Proxy having been bitten by false allegations of PA mainly through the courts. It is a never ending battle because the second group IMHO simply don’t seem to understand what PA really is and decry it at every turn. That last statement of mine was born out of Shaun’s statement which I’m quoting here : “Disgracefully what Karen Woodall implies is that FALSE ALLEGATIONS are so low that IT IS NOT WORTHY of being reprimanded when Deceitful Resident Parents attempt to prevent Children from seeing their non resident parent AND THAT PARENTAL ALIENATION is not based in FACT.”

    (if I’ve read Shaun’s posts correctly which is hard because his posts are so very angry)
    Waiting to be shot down……

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    1. I don’t really understand what Shaun is saying or what he is angry about if I am honest Willow, I just don’t like seeing posts from facebook groups which mislead vulnerable parents. Much damage is done by inexperienced people in this space, I just want parents to have solid, well researched evidence and to be represented by people who know what they are talking about. I don’t know what I am in disgrace for but then someone in some corner of the internet has always got it in for me – if I believed a fraction of what is written about me on the internet I would lock myself up and throw away the key!! x

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    2. Willow, I’m not going to shoot anyone down, regardless of gender. Shaun does raise pertinent points where one gender is the target more then the other gender. So, if the chap comes across ‘shouty shouty’ to those who remain gender biased his points are justified are they not?

      In the world I inhabit, the main target parent is the father. The false allegations include every false allegation from the minuscule to the extreme perverse. The ultra feminists and their femimen entrenched within government and judiciary etc are of the opinion ALL men deserve what they get – and more. We, the target parent are helpless and disturbingly destroyed in profession, financial, employment and abode..many lose everything. Some commit suicide..Just what the system wants. I deplore all ultra feminists. I despise those who destroy the lives of innocent children and their fathers because they can..So, if your offended by Shaun’s post because he may just reinforce the points, you must be totally oblivious to the very real issues impacting upon the majority of alienated parents that being of the Male gender. I for one applaud Shaun’s post..

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      1. for standing up for alienated fathers, I got a whole lot of attack from feminists and a seriously unwell stalker with a vicious agenda against me, so before anyone calls me a feminist or an anti-father supporter, think carefully – there’s a lot of projection going on these days and shouty posts like Shaun’s and your lectures to Willow Pete are part of that. I’m not offended, if I’m honest, I just don’t like people shouting at me when they’ve clearly not bothered to read a word of what I write.

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      2. Karen, I’m certainly not a stalker more of an alienated father who is giving an honest opinion..I don’t recall calling you or Willow a feminist. I’m all for equality across all spectrum of life. I value your posts immensely and this forum. I have a voice. Something removed from all alienated parents, grandparents and children by a corrupt system and associated services. I respect all contributors, regardless if I agree or disagree with their opinions. If I have unintentionally caused offence with any posts I sincerely apologise. May I suggest a line is drawn under the rather challenging posts which may have diverted from the matters at hand and move forwards to recover the equilibrium of the forum.

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      3. Pete, I want to be really clear with you because one of the things I am seeing in the discussion on this thread, which emerged from Shaun’s shouty post which made all sorts of ridiculous assumptions about what my post was saying, is that none of this is personal. My responses are not targeting you, I am not saying you called me a feminist, I am not offended by anything you said – or indeed what Shaun said. What I am trying to get over to the people who read this blog is that misinformation is unhelpful to vulnerable parents. That’s all I am saying. Don’t read into replies, things that are not there.

        The stalker I refer to is not you. She is a very angry woman who is likely to be unwell mentally who has made up a fantasy about me and others from the UK government. She is dangerous because of her mindset and lack of insight into her own behaviours which is why the police are involved. Fortunately we now all know who she is and where she is and the police have the evidence which disproves her allegations and she no longer knows where we live and so we are safe. But this kind of thing is a serious problem for anyone who does this work and so having Shaun coming on shouting at me about stuff he clearly doesn’t understand, is not exactly what I call welcome.

        Yes indeed we can draw a line under this – the whole post was simply to give vulnerable parents access to correct information, which is all I am interested in all of the time.

        You are always welcome here Pete, as is Shaun if he reads stuff properly first. K

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  7. anexcellent article and at a time when fathers in particular are under threat from the efforts of womens groups to manipulate this bill to further disadvantage fathers in their battles in the family court very important in keeping everybody properly aware. i understand that the bill will now be non gender specific which is a start but philip davies’s amendments will be fiercely opposed by the many womens groups invoilved. these are the same womens gropups who regard fathers as using parental alienation as an attack on mothers.Even more important then to maintain a calm .well-informed and balanced reaction and that is exactly what you have done here Karen

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    1. Exactly but more needs to be done. As Women’s Aid and a slew of toxic support groups. Are trying to prevent reasonable and logical protections for decent parents from Charlatan psychologists (NOT YOU KAREN) and the delusional PROPAGANDA merchants who have been warped by their bad experiences.

      I AM ALL for BALANCE! When it is rooted IN TRUTH. I speak FOR ALIENATED NON RESIDENT PARENTS. FEMALE AND MALE ALIKE.

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  8. Karen Peter, I am shocked at the way you are working. Why on earth are you targeting several groups who posted in good faith, following reading a plagiarised post. Why aren’t you angry about the group who are deliberately misleading grieving parents.
    WHY ?

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    1. Anne, first of all the Peter who posted the piece is not the Peter you think it is – so I suggest you stop making assumptions. Secondly, WHO is targeting several groups? Not me. Stop making assumptions – there is nothing going on here other than helping people to have a clear understanding of what is going on. Stop living in conspiracy world.

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  9. My (no longer live with him) husband believed passionately in equality. He believed women were perfectly capable of carrying their own (heavy) shopping bags without a man’s help. He also believed that the young girl who showed us to our family room in Germany was perfectly capable of carrying our heavy suitcase up three flights of steep stairs
    (just saying, with an ironic smile on my face not aimed at anyone ……….)

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  10. Firstly Karen I did apologize and explained the reasons why I took that stance. But a person cannot SHOUT in text.

    The reason I took that stance was that one of my fellow campaigners asked me to come on the forum as he felt you were siding with not having parental alienation mentioned in the Domestic Abuse Bill. And that he had some problems with biased critique. obviously I KNOW now that THIS WAS NOT THE CASE.

    But yes thank you for the information update and I will be awaiting your next post.

    Kind regards

    Shaun

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  11. Many thanks for posting this Karen.

    After reading this earlier today, I contacted my MP and asked him to assist Philip Davies in any way he can. I also wrote to Philip Davies giving him some pointers on his proposed amendements based on my experience with the judiciary.

    My MP contacted Mr Davies to offer his support and Mr Davies wrote back just now to say:

    “The government have now included parental alienation in the statutory guidance to sit alongside the Domestic Abuse Bill which is a very good step forward”

    Fingers crossed.

    Teli

    Like

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